Intention

Following on from this, does anyone have any good mindset/adrenaline drills to share? We try various things to get the striker in the proper mental and physical state - working to near exhaustion and then striking, having the feeder shout (and, when appropriate, swear) at the striker before and during the drill etc., but we're always open to new methods. The aim is to get to the ratio of 5% technique, 95% intention. I've just recently started to look into FAST training. Does anyone have any experience of that?

One drill I've done with people is a variation of Iain's aggressive pad drills he did at the seminar you organised Lee. I got it a few years ago from watching a demo by Andy Hopwood of the BFFA and an old video I have by Phil Norman (a JKD man some might remember from doing Gladiators). Iain's drills echo'd what the drill is about.

I call it "bump and hit".

The person doing the drill stands in the middle with their eyes shut.

3-4 People walk around them holding thai pads (or kick shields). They can shout, swear, bang the pads close to them, remain totally silent etc. Essentially building up the sense of aprehension.

At a silent signal (the instructor pointing at them perhaps) one of the pad men bumps the holder with the pad. Not hard, just a strong nudge.

That's the signal to the middle person to open their eyes, turn to face the bumper and respond as aggressively as possible.

If he's bumped high the person responds with a series of pre-arranged highline techniques (Iain's multiple palm strikes or some elbows perhaps) if he's bumped low it's multiple/skip knees. Pre-arranging the techniques means they can focus soley on intent and aggression as both pad man and hitter know what's coming. When they've done 3-4 strikes they go back to the centre to start again. Repeat as needed. They can wait some time before bumping or get them again rapidly. It's up to the instructor really.

The idea with the drill to go from a state of calm awareness and non-aggression to 100mph in a split second. Closing the eyes can heighten the apprehension and expectation I think. People I've done it with seemed to get something out of it.

I think that ability to switch on is a vital skill for SD, as is the ability to seem calm and collected right before you go all tasmanian devil on someone. :)

Thanks PASmith, that's one i'm gonna try out for sure.

Some really great ideas!

For adrenaline stuff, when I had a class I experiemented alot with having people make themselves dizzy by spinning in circles long enough that they were actually stumbling a bit, it actually does a moderately good job of simulate the "heavy legs" and other effects of adrenaline.

Not perfect by any means but it's a good way to see how lack of balance and poor vision affects things, it's funny because occasionally some stuff actually seems to work better than normal. For the more "traditionall inclined" you can find some real gems in your kata by working two man drills this way, at a pretty good clip, you start to see the real gems because again..there is some stuff that will actually function quite well even with this deifcit..and those are the keepers!

Thanks for that PASmith. I'll spring that on them soon.

PASmith wrote:

I call it "bump and hit".

Good drill! I may well steal that one off you.

All the best,

Iain

I was really taken with Iain's take on padwork where he wanted people to be champing at the bit for the signal to unleash the next combination.

The drill I described takes that but tries to get people to have that feeling on tap without actually displaying it externally. Literally like turning a tap on.

There's a guy on another forum I go to who's a 70 year old Aikidoka that basically puts the ability to switch on in that way at the top of what's needed to prevail for real.

PASmith wrote:

There's a guy on another forum I go to who's a 70 year old Aikidoka that basically puts the ability to switch on in that way at the top of what's needed to prevail for real.

Makes sense.  Our body and mind should be good to go, not need a physical warm-up or monkey dance to get us primed.  When I talk about this on/off switch during SP training people look at me a bit strange, almost like I'm a grenade waiting to explode, but that's really not how I see it.

I decide when I pull the pin out.   I believe the confidence that I can switch on if required makes me calmer than most.

Gary

I realise this being an  older topic - but im gonna pull something, that most of you guys probably will shout of - but please, think first - then answar...

I practice Kyusho ( please don't stop reading! ) and the most important thing i get from this training is the ability to harm another being - not just "i will stop my punch so i won't damage you" but i will hit you and try to knock you out - afterwards, you can do it on me.

I start up soft, as with everything and then continue onward.

Start with slapping eachother in the face, not just slapiwonthurtyou, but litterally try to find the bounderies for your pain treshold - slap eachother about 10-15-20 times, then feel how it feels to connect to the other guys cheek with your bare hands - then you can play around with putting more or less "power" into the attack.

Another place where you also can train, without making to much damage, is the torso area - try to impact on the person - and this is a great way of training both pain absorbing techniques (kote aite) and impacting. Start with really connecting to eachother.

The most important thing here is, laugh, after each hit - laugh, make fun - this takes away most of the fear and the pain.

After all 90% of us train for the fun of it

 **EDIT**

To add: I rarely do padwork, hence i find that the pads are so different structured than impacting a human body. But they are great fun to exercise - and they don't quit your training - after som solid hits!

Good training

Nikolaj

That makes little sense to me.

Good fighting is using appropriate levels of force to subdue the attacker or escape the area whilst minimising damage to ourselves. 

A slapping contest doesn't fit into that description.  I understand the thought - before tournaments we used to train our conditioning with blows to the body and legs - but there's no way I'd submit to being repeatedly punched/slapped in the face, even if I got to go next.

Gary

Gary Chamberlain wrote:

That makes little sense to me.

Good fighting is using appropriate levels of force to subdue the attacker or escape the area whilst minimising damage to ourselves. 

Exactly - i fail to see, where what i have written fails to do that? It is not a contest, it is a method to learn to control your aggressiveness (to get the feeling and to be able to control it when being hit) and a method of not restraining yourself from hitting another person in the head.

last time i did a seminar, i brought this drill up as #1 - most of them was hesitating to slap the other person and all of the didn't strike as hard with the first shot as with the last. I allways introduce this by taking a voluntary person and telling him/her to slap me in the face.

Normal persons have a hard time wanting to hit another human - especially in the head, hence training the intention will help person override this obstacle.

I know i for one learned not to hit others when i was in my early school years!

Kyoshi wrote:

Gary Chamberlain wrote:

That makes little sense to me.

Good fighting is using appropriate levels of force to subdue the attacker or escape the area whilst minimising damage to ourselves. 

Exactly - i fail to see, where what i have written fails to do that? It is not a contest, it is a method to learn to control your aggressiveness (to get the feeling and to be able to control it when being hit) and a method of not restraining yourself from hitting another person in the head.

last time i did a seminar, i brought this drill up as #1 - most of them was hesitating to slap the other person and all of the didn't strike as hard with the first shot as with the last. I allways introduce this by taking a voluntary person and telling him/her to slap me in the face.

Normal persons have a hard time wanting to hit another human - especially in the head, hence training the intention will help person override this obstacle.

I know i for one learned not to hit others when i was in my early school years!

Ahhhhhh

There lies the paradox.  I want to control my aggressiveness before I get hit.  Use dialogue, body language, reason in fact anything that stops things getting physical.  But once hit (if I was ever to let that happen) I don't want to control my aggression, I want to use it to win in the shortest possible time.  So far, that has meant pain for the attacker and I see no reason to change a tried and tested strategy. 

To quote Mick Coup, "Fighting is like Christmas, it's all about the giving" 

Each to their own. 

Gary

Kyoshi wrote:

I rarely do padwork, hence i find that the pads are so different structured than impacting a human body. But they are great fun to exercise - and they don't quit your training - after some solid hits!

The pads are different to the human body, but the bottom line is that you can’t strike the human body full force over and over again in order to develop powerful techniques. We need to hit hard in order to learn to hit harder. Air training won’t do it. And neither will pulled slaps or strikes. I can’t see how you can develop power without pads?

Kyoshi wrote:

Start with slapping each other in the face, not just slapiwonthurtyou, but literally try to find the boundaries for your pain threshold - slap each other about 10-15-20 times, then feel how it feels to connect to the other guys cheek with your bare hands - then you can play around with putting more or less "power" into the attack.

The trouble with this – if not supported by pad work – is that you are always pulling shots. You never learn to throw a technique full force because it is something you have never done. Slaps to the face are on my syllabus as a pre-emptive technique from day one. I have absolutely no doubt that if any of my 8th kyus or higher (around 6 months of training) delivered their slaps to the actual face of their partners, with even a fraction of the force possible, people would be KO’d every class or worse.

It’s not about their pain threshold, but the power of their strikes being such that it’s not about pain, but total shutdown of the body. And this is not theoretical either. I have a number of students and training partners who have KO’d people with slaps with relative ease. If people were able to withstand one of their slaps (in training or elsewhere), I would say that the slap is a very weak one. I don’t want them practising weak slaps; which is what never using pads would necessitate.

As regards in-fight, sparring will ensure they can get their hand to the head: pad works ensures it is capable of taking them out when it gets there. Pads alone are not enough, but I feel we will have major problems when it comes to power if they are totally omitted. I see pads as an absolute necessity and I really can’t see how effectiveness can be achieved without their frequent use.

Pads also give us the opportunity to go “full bore” with maximum aggression and impact in away that is not safe or practical if we were to do the same on training partners (people would die!).

Same with the torso too. I know well conditioned people can take relatively solid shots to the body, but we humans are not armour plated and we have limits. If I were to let someone like Steve Williams (one of my regular train partners) hit me in the body full power I have no doubt I’d be in the hospital (if I lived long enough to make it there). Hard hitters need pads to work on.

Kyoshi wrote:

Normal persons have a hard time wanting to hit another human - especially in the head, hence training the intention will help person override this obstacle.

Sparring will do that too and the aggression developed from pad-work can also help enable people to switch into “a force of nature” that will have no such qualms.

The methods you describe has the problem that they are not hitting full force. They may be OK slapping their partner, but it’s a different mindset again to slap will the intention of destroying as opposed to slapping  to train or condition.

Gary Chamberlain wrote:

There lies the paradox.  I want to control my aggressiveness before I get hit.  Use dialogue, body language, reason in fact anything that stops things getting physical. But once hit (if I was ever to let that happen) I don't want to control my aggression, I want to use it to win in the shortest possible time. 

I totally agree with that. When it’s time to get physical then it’s time to get physical. Aggression is absolutely vital when we are forced into having to fight. Aggression is not wild unfocused anger, so we need to avoid that potential confusion. It’s a laser focused, extremely intense, animalistic, predatory state that we’ve evolved to help us deal with violent situations. We are all alive today because our ancestors made good use of their aggression when they found themselves in conflict (the ones that remained passive will have died and been removed from the gene pool). Aggression can be extremely negative when inappropriately triggered in everyday life, but for conflict it’s not only positive but an absolute necessity. It’s needs to be utilised, not suppressed.

Gary Chamberlain wrote:

To quote Mick Coup, "Fighting is like Christmas, it's all about the giving"

I like it :-)

All the best,

Iain

Iain Abernethy wrote:

 If I were to let someone like Steve Williams (one of my regular train partners) hit me in the body full power I have no doubt I’d be in the hospital (if I lived long enough to make it there). Hard hitters need pads to work on.

Steve needs a pad about 3 feet thick.  My ribs still ache on cold mornings

Gary