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Jordan Giarratano
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Ego in Karate and the Dojo

"Punches and kicks are tools to kill the ego." 

I love this Bruce Lee quote so much I had it printed as a sign and it hangs on the main door of our dojo. 

Growing up in karate (I started training at 13, am now 34), it was always clear to me that karate was a path to conquering myself. Ironically, when I opened my own dojo four years ago, one of my biggest challenges was managing my students egos. Whether it was expressed as someone compelled to show off, draw negative attention to themselves, go too hard in sparring, overreact to being hit while sparring, get overly frustrated with struggling to learn a technique, creating drama in the community, etc it seemed like a lot of our issues came back to people struggling to separate their insecurities or what they believe about themselves from the reality of the training experience.

My instructor was great at managing egos and there is something about the belt system and the continued progression of difficult tests that puts people in a position to decide if they are going to grow or walk away. As a teacher I really struggled with it for the first few years of having my dojo open. He and I are a little different personality-wise (he's a cop, I'm an artist). It's also important to note that his school is in Pennsylvania and mine is in Seattle. When he opened he had a dozen black belts (his teacher had closed his dojo, so everyone went to train at my instructors new dojo) as senior students. When I opened I had zero senior students (well, zero students at all). So, within my dojo, it was not until this year (my fourth) that I'd developed senior students who could effecitvely model behavior and attitude for the other students. And even then, they take their cues from me, they themselves don't actually have other senior students to model their behavior after. 

I made some changes this year in posting our "community values" and "code of conduct" on the wall for all to see. And reinforced some of the traditional concepts and explained why we bow, etc and that helped a lot.

The reason I share this with all of you fellow martial artists of this great community is I'm curious about the following two things:

1. I'm curious to know, in your dojos or in your own personal training, what are the most effective methods for keeping student's egos in check? How did you overcome your own challenges with ego limiting your growth as a martial artist?

2. Has this always been a part of karate or was this an ad hoc character development thing that came in later? For me it feels very natural: if you're going to teach someone how to beat someone up, you should also teach them how to control themselves. Me personally, I won't teach anyone to fight unless they are a member of my belt program, and only then once they've hit green belt.

*Also, just for the sake of simplifying the discussion, I define ego more in Buddhist terms as: "the self-identity we cling to / the stories we tell ourselves about who we are (i.e. I'm an athlete, I'm great at martial arts, I'm clumsy, etc)" as opposed to the general expression of arrogance/self-interest/confidence. We all have an ego and it's not always a bad thing. In some of my students (mostly my teens and many of my female students, I actively cultivate ego and encourage it).

 

OnlySeisan
OnlySeisan's picture

You're not a therapist. Stop worrying about trying to fix people. Just do your job and try and make sure the crazy people don't learn the dangerous stuff.

Those people have personal problems that karate was not designed to solve. Karate was designed to get you back home in one piece.

Everything else is advertising.

 

Th0mas
Th0mas's picture

I think that is a little harsh Onlyseisan.

Although I agree that there is a lot of guff attributed to martial arts training, it does play a role in building self confidence. Not because of anything inherent in the particulars of a dojo class, but more in terms of an emergent benefit. 

For all of us, but especially in the case of teanagers and young adults, undertaking any physical activity that requires mental and physical commitment and delivers a sense of achievement is healthy for creating a sense of wellbeing. This is not particular to karate.

Also for young men in particular, where physical prowess and self confidence are traits that define who they are and how they see themselves in comparison with their contemporaries, a martial art does tick a number of boxes.

Being over egotistical in any environment is an indicator that an individual has low self esteem. Selfish and bullying behaviour is not good for them or anybody who has to associate with them. I can't believe there is anybody on this forum who hasn't come across this type of person at some point in there training in martial arts.

Given the nature of what we do, it can attract a certain type of person and it is beholden on the sensei, to ensure that respect for other people and those they train with goes hand in hand with martial skill. 

I think that is best done by leading through example, especially if you hold a position of authority and potential respect, students will want to emulate what you do and how you behave. Leaders have a responsibily to create this kind of atmosphere which is then reflected in the behaviours of the seniors and picked up by new students when they join. Karate is not really a team exercise, but I believe the dynamic in a dojo is not dissimilar to a sporting team, such as you see in Rugby etc. In fact if you are involved in rugby these types of selfless behaviour traits are actively encourage and can be witnessed in any local club, in word and in deed, even if arguably it does not have a direct impact on rugby skill.

Cheers

Tom

OnlySeisan
OnlySeisan's picture

Here's some real advice.

Punish bad behavior. Make them do push ups, mop the floors, run laps, kick them out of class.

Reward good students by complimenting them or using them as examples. "Nice control Timmy. You got hit in the face but you didn't get angry that takes a lot of guts and composure."

You don't rub their shoulders and say "It's okay, you're special, you're a unique snow flake, you're just misunderstood. It's okay that you disrupted the entire class."

There's no lesson there. If you're a teacher, teach them lessons and the lesson is that there is a consequence for every action.

By the way if leading by example is the answer, it means you're not leading by example, which means you're misbehaving.

Are you misbehaving? It doesn't sound like it.

Iain Abernethy
Iain Abernethy's picture

Jordan Giarratano wrote:
The reason I share this with all of you fellow martial artists of this great community is I'm curious about the following two things:

1. I'm curious to know, in your dojos or in your own personal training, what are the most effective methods for keeping student's egos in check? How did you overcome your own challenges with ego limiting your growth as a martial artist?

2. Has this always been a part of karate or was this an ad hoc character development thing that came in later? For me it feels very natural: if you're going to teach someone how to beat someone up, you should also teach them how to control themselves. Me personally, I won't teach anyone to fight unless they are a member of my belt program, and only then once they've hit green belt.

I’m currently writing a podcast on this very topic! My typical podcasts are around 3000 words or so long. This one in 6000 words and I’ve got a few issues I want to cover yet! So I’ll save my reply for the podcast. I hope you find it interesting. All going well, it should be out within the week.

All the best,

Iain

Andi Kidd
Andi Kidd's picture

OnlySeisan wrote:

You're not a therapist. Stop worrying about trying to fix people. Just do your job and try and make sure the crazy people don't learn the dangerous stuff.

Those people have personal problems that karate was not designed to solve. Karate was designed to get you back home in one piece.

Everything else is advertising.

In some ways I agree with you, however if you are teaching karate from purely a self-protection point of view, then controlling the ego is a key skill (especially for young men) in avoiding social violence. 

Jordan Giarratano
Jordan Giarratano's picture

OnlySeisan wrote:

You're not a therapist. Stop worrying about trying to fix people. Just do your job and try and make sure the crazy people don't learn the dangerous stuff.

Those people have personal problems that karate was not designed to solve. Karate was designed to get you back home in one piece.

Everything else is advertising.

Respectfully, "You're not a therapist" is kind of a cop-out response to a complex issue. Whether you teach in a small club or a big school, the simple act of gathering humans together is going to result in interactions with people's needs, fears, emotions, and insecurities. It's nothing to do with what karate was designed for, you get it in any type of class. It's not the what of teaching karate that leads to the ego, but the how of teaching. When you take on the responsibility to teach others, there's always going to be an element of guidance involved. 

There's definitely an element in reality-based karate of shying away from this because there's so much cult-like bullshit in our history -- and nobody wants to be associated with that! But let's look at another field. I am a certified personal trainer. As part of my training I learned about nutrition, but with the caveat that I should not be dispensing nutritional advice as that is not my field of specification. When I work with a student, I know enough about nutrition to give very basic advice, when someone asks about diet. But anything more than that and I would refer them to a dietitian or to their doctor. Same with this karate and therapy thing. I know enough to know when someone is acting out, when someone is insecure and afraid (hint: every single human on this planet is insecure and afraid), or when someone lacks the self-esteem to realize their potential. I am 100% confident in giving advice or feedback, in pushing them through specific drills, and designing the operating procedures of my dojo around common problems I encounter. If it's one of my high-level students, sometimes I just get a beer with them and ask what's up and be a friend.  That said, the second I perceive someone viewing me as a therapist or putting me in some kind of "guru" position, I know how to shut it down and to tactfully suggest they explore therapy or counseling. 

I don't think at all that all martial arts instructors should have a deep emotional connection with all of their students or that every karate instructor should be aiming to be a wise, old mentor, but the reality is, any time you get a group of humans together, there will be some bristling about how they interact. Moreso if they get to punch each other in the face every Wednesday. The boundaries you set for yourself as a teacher and for the dojo kind of dictate how comfortable you can get interacting with these people. Sometimes it's as simple as kicking people out, which I've done, or as easy as just knowing when to push and when to praise.

Even if I was teaching Krav Maga or some reality-based combat, I'd still focus on ego, if for no reason other than controlling your ego will keep you safer than any martial arts technique. Men operate under a tremendous amount of pressure to "act tough" or "keep it under control" and this makes it really challenging to get through to a lot of male students, especially beginners. All of the technique in the world isn't worth a damn if after two years someone still worries about "proving themselves" or not "failing" in front of others.

Th0mas wrote:

Being over egotistical in any environment is an indicator that an individual has low self esteem. Selfish and bullying behaviour is not good for them or anybody who has to associate with them. I can't believe there is anybody on this forum who hasn't come across this type of person at some point in there training in martial arts.

Given the nature of what we do, it can attract a certain type of person and it is beholden on the sensei, to ensure that respect for other people and those they train with goes hand in hand with martial skill. 

Completely agree. It's been my experience that martial arts have a tendency to attract a certain type of person, the goals themselves almost imply that insecurity ("I want to fight back" or "I want to feel strong") and there is a tendency to project this need onto an instructor. That's how this nonsense gets started. If the teacher has ego-problems and thrives on being "held up" by his students, you get the kind of craziness we see in the world of karate sometimes. I was no different when I started. But as a teacher now, I really don't like being put in that position of being "better than" or objectified in that way, so I try to pay attention to these dynamics to understand it better.

Y'know, and sometimes you get super chill people who have their selves under control and just want a good workout and a sense of community. Those are the easy ones ;)

Jordan Giarratano
Jordan Giarratano's picture

Iain Abernethy wrote:

Jordan Giarratano wrote:
The reason I share this with all of you fellow martial artists of this great community is I'm curious about the following two things:

1. I'm curious to know, in your dojos or in your own personal training, what are the most effective methods for keeping student's egos in check? How did you overcome your own challenges with ego limiting your growth as a martial artist?

2. Has this always been a part of karate or was this an ad hoc character development thing that came in later? For me it feels very natural: if you're going to teach someone how to beat someone up, you should also teach them how to control themselves. Me personally, I won't teach anyone to fight unless they are a member of my belt program, and only then once they've hit green belt.

I’m currently writing a podcast on this very topic! My typical podcasts are around 3000 words or so long. This one in 6000 words and I’ve got a few issues I want to cover yet! So I’ll save my reply for the podcast. I hope you find it interesting. All going well, it should be out within the week.

All the best,

Iain

Looking forward to it. The "Healthy Relationship to Violence" podcast was great and I feel it's a similar mindspace in some ways.