12 posts / 0 new
Last post
Wastelander
Wastelander's picture
The Purpose of Kata

Hello everyone,

I just posted an article about the purpose of kata, which is a little more philosophical in nature than I usually write.

http://www.karateobsession.com/2015/12/the-purpose-of-kata.html

Iain Abernethy
Iain Abernethy's picture

Thanks for sharing Noah! I will share it via the lists later today.

All the best,

Iain

Mark B
Mark B's picture

It's true that an individual can practice kata for any number of reasons. However, kata came into being as the memories of somebodys experiences. They are a collection of sound combative applications and principles borne of the real experiences of an individual or group many moons ago, so in my opinion, regardless of what people want them to be this is the truth of the matter. All the best Mark

Marc
Marc's picture

Of course (most) karate katas were created as a collection of methods and principles of self-defence. And Noah's article does not dispute that.

What he points out is that we can find those ideas in kata (only) if we are looking for them. But we can find other benefits as well, depending on what we want to find.

Think of writing: It was originally designed for communication or for remembering stuff. But writing can be much more if we want it to be. It can be an exercise for fine motor coordination, it can be a meditative art (calligraphy), it can be therapy (getting something of one's chest), it can be a thinking tool (ordering one's thoughts), it can be a punishment (you write this a hundred times!), it can be commitment (a signature), and much more.

I have collected some more things one might find in kata in an article of mine: What's so special about Karate?

All the best, Marc  

Mark B
Mark B's picture

You're quite correct. Writing could be all these things, but if asked "what is the purpose of writing" the answer would be communication and recording. The fact that individuals may choose to find other uses is great - but it doesn't detract from the answer to the original question. The same applies to the question "the purpose of kata". Whilst I don't disagree with anything said in the piece I'm merely stating that the correct answer to the question is the one I gave in my original post. I'm not aiming to get into a long, drawn out debate on the issue. It does seem that on this forum these days there is very little room for an opinion that causes even the slightest ripple, which only serves to stifle debate. I place my teaching out there in the public domain, I teach seminars to people not of my club. I choose to do this, and in doing so I accept that there will be individuals who don't get my approach. I'm quite OK with that, and will always endeavour to explain my position. If differences still exist that's fine, in putting my stuff, and my opinion of there this is at times, inevitable. Regards Mark

Iain Abernethy
Iain Abernethy's picture

Marc wrote:
What he points out is that we can find those ideas in kata (only) if we are looking for them. But we can find other benefits as well, depending on what we want to find.

Mark B wrote:
It's true that an individual can practice kata for any number of reasons. However, kata came into being as the memories of somebodys experiences.

I think you are agreeing here. Maybe we can summarise the distinction this way:

I think we can say there is a difference between “the purpose of kata” and “the original purpose of kata”. The original purpose is the preservation and dissemination of combative methods, while also providing a supplementary method of solo-training.

However, there can be no doubt that kata has other purposes today. People can and do practise kata for art, sport, health, enjoyment, etc. I have no problem with that so long as training method / approach is matching defined objective.

Mark B wrote:
It does seem that on this forum these days there is very little room for an opinion that causes even the slightest ripple, which only serves to stifle debate.

I have to say as the moderator, I’m not seeing that :-)

All the best,

Iain

Wastelander
Wastelander's picture

I can't really add to what Iain said--my point was exactly that! Regardless of the original, intended purpose of kata, the percieved purpose and value of kata is always going to be dependent upon the mindset of the person practicing it.

Iain Abernethy
Iain Abernethy's picture

Wastelander wrote:
I can't really add to what Iain said--my point was exactly that! Regardless of the original, intended purpose of kata, the perceived purpose and value of kata is always going to be dependent upon the mindset of the person practicing it.

I’m pleased my understanding matched your intent. Thanks for the clarification.

All the best,

Iain

Marc
Marc's picture

Mark B wrote:

You're quite correct. Writing could be all these things, but if asked "what is the purpose of writing" the answer would be communication and recording. The fact that individuals may choose to find other uses is great - but it doesn't detract from the answer to the original question. The same applies to the question "the purpose of kata". Whilst I don't disagree with anything said in the piece I'm merely stating that the correct answer to the question is the one I gave in my original post.

So basically we're all on the same page here: There's a purpose that kata were originally created for. And then there are many other purposes that kata can be utilised for.

However, the idea that I found so interesting in the article was this: People can often only see what they expect to find.

In debates about karate training approaches, for example, this can lead to misunderstandings. And it certainly is not limited to the practice of kata. I am thinking about long debates about the use of the word "kumite". It varies from context to context. So if in one karateka's world "kumite" has ever only ment "competition kumite" then they might not be able to accept that for another karateka "kumite" might mean a form of partner work "used to apply offensive and defensive techniques, practiced in the kata, under more realistic conditions" (Funakoshi). And vice versa of course.

Mark B wrote:
It does seem that on this forum these days there is very little room for an opinion that causes even the slightest ripple, which only serves to stifle debate. I place my teaching out there in the public domain, I teach seminars to people not of my club. I choose to do this, and in doing so I accept that there will be individuals who don't get my approach. I'm quite OK with that, and will always endeavour to explain my position. If differences still exist that's fine, in putting my stuff, and my opinion of there this is at times, inevitable. Regards Mark

I'm sorry, Mark, if I failed to express myself adequately. I merely wanted to highlight another point I took from the article. I hope I did a better job this time.

And I do enjoy your videos. They're very much appreciated.

All the best, Marc

Iain Abernethy
Iain Abernethy's picture

Marc wrote:
People can often only see what they expect to find.

I think that’s very true. We see this all the time when people can only see dubious “blocks”, kick and punches because that is what they are conditioned to see. Whereas, those like ourselves see much more.

Beyond the original intent upon which we tend to focus (quite rightly in my view), I do see benefit in kata as exercise and for the promotion of mental and physical health. I’m also not adverse to the by-product of the aesthetics and art of kata either (providing they are a by-product of function and not arbitrary aesthetic “standards” divorced from function). It feels good to move in that way, and I find myself in admiration of the “beauty” of the kata of those who move well.  So I think that these secondary befits are of value too, and I do “find” them in kata, but I would never have them so highly valued that they distract from the primary / original purpose of kata.

All the best,

Iain

Mark B
Mark B's picture

Hi Marc. Thanks for that, I'm glad you enjoy the clips. You made your points very well, and I can't disagree. I do know I can be a bit pig headed at times. :-) Hi Iain, you are also spot on. I myself love practicing a kata just for the pleasure of it. I enjoy the feeling of connection with the history of the art, to feel I'm stepping through a form, and that individuals would have been practicing the same, or something close, hundreds of years ago in China is a pretty cool thing. I also love watching my juniors practicing their Naihanchi (the only kata they learn). Of course our main focus is the sensible application of the techniques and principles, but I must confess to considering that in front of me is another generation of young people who are learning to love the form, for practical reasons, and just for the pleasure of it too.

Regards

Mark

dhogsette
dhogsette's picture

I thoroughly enoyed this article and shared it in various FB martial arts groups. It received many likes, positive comments, and further shares.

It's amazing to me just how many karateka have a narrow view of kata and kata practice, and this is true in a variety of circles. I find some who view kata mainly as exercise, or mainly as martial arts aesthetics, or mainly as personal movement self-expression, or mainly combative. Each "circle" can be narrow in its own ways. Personally, I now lean more toward the combative interpretation of kata. However, what I appreciate from Iain's approach and example is that while we should indeed focus on the practical combative elements of kata, we do not (nor should we) ignore nor dismiss the other aspects (health, exercise, aesthetics, personal expression, etc.). I appreciate the broader, holistic approach. Indeed, combative techniques are primary for me, but I also like to indulge the other secondary elements. And, no matter what perspective I'm using at any given time I practice kata (bunkai, aesthetics, movement, proper form as per my style), there is always the health benefit (exercise, cardio, balance, etc.).

For me, it comes down to always knowing what one is doing and why one is doing it whenever practicing kata. As such, kata practice provides boundlessly diverse experiences in training.

Thanks for a great article!

Best,

David